Israel, a country where it's hard to live ... if you are Jewish!

[mosheh5769]

Here is a translation of an article in a French newspaper (from November the 7th, 2009) that can be viewed on the following French website: http://www.voxnr.com/cc/etranger/EkypkpklVFlrZlKHRZ.shtml

Israel, a country where it's hard to live ... if you are Jewish!


The State of Israel was conceived and designed by its founders as a place where Jews from around the world would be safe.

In reading the newspapers at the end of 2009, we could say they are totally wrong and that many Israelis are bitterly regretting their own Aliyah or the Aliyah of their parents.

The following examples are extracts from the Israeli or Zionist press and have been identified only in the last fortnight.

In Israel, discrimination in hiring does exist! So if you are a Haredi (Jewish religious) or a Falasha (Ethiopian Jew), your chance to get hired is as thin as that an ... Arab! That is according to a study by the Faculty of Kiryat Ono. And worse, says the study, if Haredim or Beta Israel are finally hired, they have "little opportunity for upward mobility, since 86% of employers are reluctant to grant promotions to Haredim and 70% to Ethiopian Jews. "

Not very surprised by what he had discovered, Moshe Karif, who led the research, said: "The survey results are unflattering. We like to think we are a multicultural and open society, but the data show that we still have much to do on equal opportunities. However, it is, he says, "still too early to devise concrete measures such as affirmative action or quota method."

In Israel, chronic depression strikes one third of the population! According to a recent survey, when asked if they have developed symptoms related to depression during the past month, between 21% and 37% of respondents answered "often" or "all the time. According to Prof. Amiram Raviv, who had sponsored the survey, "A comparison with previous studies indicates a significant increase in symptoms of depression and anxiety among the Israelis." No suprise about that fact!

In Israel, political correctness is the standard in the universities! The association Im Tirtsu has denounced "the discrimination against students and ideas of right in some national universities in Israel." As the freedom of expression that is systematicelly denied to right-wing students by the academic leaders of the University of Tel Aviv. The President of the student movement, Amit Barak, said that "it is also the case in other universities in the country, sometimes even rude. The association receives testimonials from students who complain of systematic discrimination against students who are not in the political line of the majority of teachers. These complaints involve humiliation, roadblocks to freedom of expression and attitude of public disdain. (...) Some teachers hang on their door posters of far-left movements."

In Israel, there is a growing old population! The Israeli Gerontological Society has published its latest figures last week and has warned that Israel must take care of his elderly because they are more numerous and poorer. In Israel, in fact, 22% of seniors live below the poverty line (for comparison, in Europe, the proportion does not exceed 10%). And the elderly represented only 4% of the population in 1948 . Today, that figure reached 10% and should rise to 14% in 2030, a higher proportion than in Europe or the United States.

In Israel, Jews are ripped off by other Jews! According to the bulletin of the Franco-Israeli Chamber of Commerce "the madoffism is not only a U.S. practice. As Bernard Madoff in the United States, charismatic personalities in Israel have created real "private banks" that enabled them to enrich themselves at the expense of depositors. Until the house of cards they built collapsed with a crash. In Israel, the targets of these private bankers have been very different: the world of sport, the community of Orthodox Haredim or militaries, and even the former Israeli residents of Gaza. "

In Israel, Jews are poor! Israeli Social Security has updated its figures estimating poverty in the country. We know well that 1,651,300 Israelis live below the poverty line, or 23.7% of the Israeli population. Moreover, the living standards of all Israelis has declined slightly (-0.6% in real terms). Among children, the report indicates that 783,600 Israeli children live below the poverty line, or one out of three. In international comparison, Israel topped the rankings in Western countries for the poverty rate. Israel has a poverty rate higher than even the United States (17.1%) and Mexico (18.4%) which are yet considered as the OECD countries where we found the highest proportion of poor.

In Israel, banks defraud the survivors of the Holocaust! It took a seventy years court battle for Hapoalim, Leumi and Discount (israeli banks) agree to return more than 400 million shekels theyillegally held, to the organization defending the assets of Holocaust victims who will transfer the money to thousands Survivors of the Shoah and their descendants who demanded the return of such funds. Note that the Mizrahi Bank and Mercantile Discount still refuse to transfer their funds (they hold respectively 20 million and 11.5 million shekels), despite calls from Kanor Zvi, president of the association defending the rights of victims of the Holocaust which stresses the importance of returning the money as soon as possible "to make an historical justice to the victims and their descendants and to improve their lives as best as we can during their last years. "

"The Only democracy in the Middle East", as never fails to recall "the professional press", Israel seems to be also the perfect embodiment of all the shortcomings of liberal democracy. Israel is the West ... and worse! It is not sure it was what Theodor Herzl had hoped...

[existwhere?]

why all the pessimism?

[mosheh5769]

why all the pessimism?
It's not pessimism, it's the reality of the actual situation of the Medinah and we are seeing more and more, day after day the failures of the Zionist ideal and ideology. Israel has become a country where Jews have the right to harm other Jews, where Jews have the right to snare other Jews, and where Torah is considered "not in the mood".

[Torah613]

Some of the things on the list don't make much sense. But whatever.

[noahidelaws]

It made sense to me. Thanks for sharing!

[Meshulam]

While I normally enjoy a good Israel bashing, this article just got on my nerves. (And I get the feeling that voxnr is not the kind of magazine I want on my coffee table).

Here is a translation of an article in a French newspaper (from November the 7th, 2009) that can be viewed on the following French website: http://www.voxnr.com/cc/etranger/EkypkpklVFlrZlKHRZ.shtml

Israel, a country where it's hard to live ... if you are Jewish!


The State of Israel was conceived and designed by its founders as a place where Jews from around the world would be safe.

In reading the newspapers at the end of 2009, we could say they are totally wrong and that many Israelis are bitterly regretting their own Aliyah or the Aliyah of their parents.

The following examples are extracts from the Israeli or Zionist press and have been identified only in the last fortnight.

What? Their information comes from "reading newspapers at the end of 2009?" Which newspapers? It isn't shocking that their information is vague and unbelievable when they clearly haven't even done research into their own positions other than "reading the newspapers."

In Israel, discrimination in hiring does exist! So if you are a Haredi (Jewish religious) or a Falasha (Ethiopian Jew), your chance to get hired is as thin as that an ... Arab! That is according to a study by the Faculty of Kiryat Ono. And worse, says the study, if Haredim or Beta Israel are finally hired, they have "little opportunity for upward mobility, since 86% of employers are reluctant to grant promotions to Haredim and 70% to Ethiopian Jews. "

Where are they getting these statistics? 86% of employers are reluctant to grant promotions? What does that even mean? With no cite to a poll (and, with no explanation of the parameters of the polling) this "data" is meaningless.

Not very surprised by what he had discovered, Moshe Karif, who led the research, said: "The survey results are unflattering. We like to think we are a multicultural and open society, but the data show that we still have much to do on equal opportunities. However, it is, he says, "still too early to devise concrete measures such as affirmative action or quota method."

86% of employers are "reluctant" to promote Haredim (whatever that means), but its "still too early to" use affirmative action or quotas? These two factoids seem to be in stark contrast to one another.

In Israel, chronic depression strikes one third of the population! According to a recent survey, when asked if they have developed symptoms related to depression during the past month, between 21% and 37% of respondents answered "often" or "all the time.

Just to be clear about this "symptoms related to depression" include the following:
*too much or too little sleep
*too much or too little appetite
*negative thoughts
*difficulty concentrating
*irritability
*thoughts of helplessness
*suicidal thoughts
Which symptoms is the article talking about? If the symptoms are too little sleep, then all of New York City suffers from symptoms of depression. If the symptoms are too much sleep, then nearly all college students are suffer from symptoms of depression. Give me a break.

According to Prof. Amiram Raviv, who had sponsored the survey, "A comparison with previous studies indicates a significant increase in symptoms of depression and anxiety among the Israelis." No suprise about that fact!

Why no surprise about that fact?

In Israel, political correctness is the standard in the universities! The association Im Tirtsu has denounced "the discrimination against students and ideas of right in some national universities in Israel." As the freedom of expression that is systematicelly denied to right-wing students by the academic leaders of the University of Tel Aviv. The President of the student movement, Amit Barak, said that "it is also the case in other universities in the country, sometimes even rude. The association receives testimonials from students who complain of systematic discrimination against students who are not in the political line of the majority of teachers. These complaints involve humiliation, roadblocks to freedom of expression and attitude of public disdain. (...) Some teachers hang on their door posters of far-left movements."

I'm not sure how this differentiates Israel with America or Europe.

In Israel, there is a growing old population! The Israeli Gerontological Society has published its latest figures last week and has warned that Israel must take care of his elderly because they are more numerous and poorer. In Israel, in fact, 22% of seniors live below the poverty line (for comparison, in Europe, the proportion does not exceed 10%). And the elderly represented only 4% of the population in 1948 . Today, that figure reached 10% and should rise to 14% in 2030, a higher proportion than in Europe or the United States.

Once again, this is true of every Western country in the world. The percentage of the population that is "elderly" is climbing everywhere. It is a symptom of a healthy democracy, and a challenge that all healthy democracies are facing more and more. It isn't an Israel thing.

In Israel, Jews are ripped off by other Jews! According to the bulletin of the Franco-Israeli Chamber of Commerce "the madoffism is not only a U.S. practice. As Bernard Madoff in the United States, charismatic personalities in Israel have created real "private banks" that enabled them to enrich themselves at the expense of depositors. Until the house of cards they built collapsed with a crash. In Israel, the targets of these private bankers have been very different: the world of sport, the community of Orthodox Haredim or militaries, and even the former Israeli residents of Gaza. "

More fun with accusations that are so vague, it would be impossible to fact-check them.

I'm not going to go through the rest of this. Its more of the same. Vague accusations, unsubstantiated claims, and little of substance. The last paragraph sums it up:

"The Only democracy in the Middle East", as never fails to recall "the professional press", Israel seems to be also the perfect embodiment of all the shortcomings of liberal democracy.

Its good to know these guys don't consider themselves professional. But I'd be more interested in knowing what they think would be a good replacement for democracy. Something tells me the answer isn't Moshiach.

[existwhere?]

It's not pessimism, it's the reality of the actual situation of the Medinah and we are seeing more and more, day after day the failures of the Zionist ideal and ideology. Israel has become a country where Jews have the right to harm other Jews, where Jews have the right to snare other Jews, and where Torah is considered "not in the mood".
This is very untrue. Torah is thriving as never before. I feel that the writers of this article have a tremendous need to improve their sense of gratitude to Hashem, Who gave us Eretz Yisrael to live in so we can do more mitzvos.

Let's focus on the positive, and the negative will slowly be weakened by itself.

[existwhere?]

In addition, it is forbidden to say LH about Eretz Yisrael. And yes, LH can be true, but we are not allowed to speak it about our Holy Land.

[noahidelaws]

Who said loshon horo about Eretz Yisroel? (That's a typical zionist response to all criticism of the state, by the way.) They're simply bringing Jews up to date with the miserable plight of their brethren under Zionist oppression. I'd have thought that's praiseworthy.

[MahTovChelkeinu]

"The Only democracy in the Middle East", as never fails to recall "the professional press", Israel seems to be also the perfect embodiment of all the shortcomings of liberal democracy.

Its good to know these guys don't consider themselves professional. But I'd be more interested in knowing what they think would be a good replacement for democracy. Something tells me the answer isn't Moshiach.

I suspect that this is a push for socialism in Israel. The end comment about Herzl is further evidence of that in my mind. The article's writer (I would assume) is a former Eastern European Jew now living in Western Europe. He likes the freedom of speech and religion that comes with living in a democracy, but wants the communists back to push his own agenda.

Who said loshon horo about Eretz Yisroel? (That's a typical zionist response to all criticism of the state, by the way.) They're simply bringing Jews up to date with the miserable plight of their brethren under Zionist oppression. I'd have thought that's praiseworthy.

So if a woman's husband is oppressive and making her miserable, is it loshon hara to publicly list the man's faults or is it praiseworthy?

[existwhere?]

Who said loshon horo about Eretz Yisroel? (That's a typical zionist response to all criticism of the state, by the way.) They're simply bringing Jews up to date with the miserable plight of their brethren under Zionist oppression. I'd have thought that's praiseworthy.
"the miserable plight of their brethren under Zionist oppression"
You sound like you're talking about Palestinians.

(FTR, I am not a Zionist in the sense of Eretz Yisrael Reishit Tzmichat Geulateinu, but this is our land and we should not bash it. "Eretz Asher Einei Elokecha Ba... meireishis hashana ad acharis Hashana." "The land that the eyes of your G-d is upon her- from the beginning of the year to the end of the year..." and I suspect that you are not as good as G-d at deciding what should be done in Eretz Yisrael.)

This is not Zionism, it is a Mitzva and will help us bring Moshiach. To quote the Maharal, Am Echad Im Torah Echad B'Eretz Echad- One Nation, One Torah, One Land.
I suspect that this is a push for socialism in Israel. The end comment about Herzl is further evidence of that in my mind. The article's writer (I would assume) is a former Eastern European Jew now living in Western Europe. He likes the freedom of speech and religion that comes with living in a democracy, but wants the communists back to push his own agenda.

So if a woman's husband is oppressive and making her miserable, is it loshon hara to publicly list the man's faults or is it praiseworthy?
Agreed.

Are you responding to me or him?

[Torah613]

Here is a translation of an article in a French newspaper (from November the 7th, 2009) that can be viewed on the following French website: http://www.voxnr.com/cc/etranger/EkypkpklVFlrZlKHRZ.shtml
I cannot read French, so I can not tell what kind of newspaper it is, nor who the author is. But it is touching to see the concern of this author for EY, especially in light of the concern of the French in general toward EY and its security ...

[noahidelaws]

So if a woman's husband is oppressive and making her miserable, is it loshon hara to publicly list the man's faults or is it praiseworthy?
False comparison. This is not a private matter. It's something that's going on all the time with our brethren in the Holy Land that we in the diaspora should be aware of.
"the miserable plight of their brethren under Zionist oppression"
You sound like you're talking about Palestinians.

(FTR, I am not a Zionist in the sense of Eretz Yisrael Reishit Tzmichat Geulateinu, but this is our land and we should not bash it. "Eretz Asher Einei Elokecha Ba... meireishis hashana ad acharis Hashana." "The land that the eyes of your G-d is upon her- from the beginning of the year to the end of the year..." and I suspect that you are not as good as G-d at deciding what should be done in Eretz Yisrael.)

This is not Zionism, it is a Mitzva and will help us bring Moshiach. To quote the Maharal, Am Echad Im Torah Echad B'Eretz Echad- One Nation, One Torah, One Land.

Again, when did I or anyone here ever "bash" the Holy Land, c"v? I was expressing protest about the oppression of our brethren under Zionist rule, and the way that this rule pollutes the Land and the Jewish people who live there, R"l. You seem unfamiliar with the words of the Chabad Rebbeim against Zionism, and also unfamiliar with the latest news. May this rule be replaced with Moshiach now, or until then, rulers who respect and follow Torah.

[mosheh5769]

If I understand correctly, we must ignore the failures and shortcomings of the State of Israel and live with the situation by convincing ourselves that everything is Ok, everything is right, and everything is "Jewish" and in accordance with Torah? That there are only happy Jews in this State? That there is no anti-Jewish discrimination in this "Jewish" country? That any person who dare to criticize the fact is making Loshon Horo or is anti-Semitic? Open your eyes. All is not rosy and Israeli must agree to put some water in their wine. Sorry to say that but your answers are in a typical Zionist tone and are giving the false "Israeli" impression that Israel is a "haven of peace for Jews". This myth does no longer exist and I am quite surprised that some "religious" still believe in it. Israel is a country where the words "Jewish solidarity" no longer exist, except when there is war (even in these cases, solidarity is not assured).

[existwhere?]

Again, when did I or anyone here ever "bash" the Holy Land, c"v? I was expressing protest about the oppression of our brethren under Zionist rule, and the way that this rule pollutes the Land and the Jewish people who live there, R"l. You seem unfamiliar with the words of the Chabad Rebbeim against Zionism, and also unfamiliar with the latest news. May this rule be replaced with Moshiach now, or until then, rulers who respect and follow Torah.
That whole article basically says that life is awful in the Holy Land, no one should want to move there. Which is Lashon Hara against the land, where yes life is hard physically, but there is tremendous ruchnius and growth there.
If I understand correctly, we must ignore the failures and shortcomings of the State of Israel and live with the situation by convincing ourselves that everything is Ok, everything is right, and everything is "Jewish" and in accordance with Torah? That there are only happy Jews in this State? That there is no anti-Jewish discrimination in this "Jewish" country? That any person who dare to criticize the fact is making Loshon Horo or is anti-Semitic? Open your eyes. All is not rosy and Israeli must agree to put some water in their wine. Sorry to say that but your answers are in a typical Zionist tone and are giving the false "Israeli" impression that Israel is a "haven of peace for Jews". This myth does no longer exist and I am quite surprised that some "religious" still believe in it. Israel is a country where the words "Jewish solidarity" no longer exist, except when there is war (even in these cases, solidarity is not assured).
Of course I'm not saying that you should ignore the failures and shortcomings of the State. But you must be specific and have respect for the Land, and speak of it positively, focusing your criticism on the government.

In my family, we are taught to be careful when we buy Israeli wine, to only state the positive about it. All the more so when you are speaking about the entire land and all its inhabitants. As great as Eretz Yisrael can be, its faults can stand out, and we have to look at the positive and state it.

[noahidelaws]

Where did it say that people shouldn't move there? I missed that. They could move there if they were so inclined despite the problems there. But pointing out the problems that the agenda-driven aliya-promoters typically want to hide from us is quite worthy. Again, you are confusing the corrupt, anti-Torah state and the Holy Land. They're night and day.

[existwhere?]

Where did it say that people shouldn't move there? I missed that. They could move there if they were so inclined despite the problems there. But pointing out the problems that the agenda-driven aliya-promoters typically want to hide from us is quite worthy. Again, you are confusing the corrupt, anti-Torah state and the Holy Land. They're night and day.
No, it's not. Especially on Chabadtalk where no one is making aliya and there is nothing positive being said about EY, go look at some of the other threads.

Are you sure you're Chabad and not Satmar?

[noahidelaws]

Ah, so you think the gov't evil deeds should be shoved under the carpet, so people don't realize that Zionism is bankrupt. Got it.
By the way, the Rebbe screamed many times against Israeli gov't coverups of their wicked deeds.

[Torah613]

... and yet he managed not to use expressions and language that sounds as if it was lifted straight out of the Neturei Karta playbook.

[mosheh5769]

Are you sure you're Chabad and not Satmar?
Always the same song "Are you Chabad or Neturei Karta?" or "Are you Chabad or Satmar?"

Anyway, this article does not criticize EY but the Medinah and facts about the Aliyah people want to hide. Where is the problem? If in your mind EY and the Medinat Yisrael are the same, I cannot do anything for you. EY is a wonderful country, the Holy Land, the Land G-d gave us forever, but the Medinah is actually a shame, and the way Jews (even survivors of the Shoah) are treated there is shameful, and treating like a Satmar or a NK someone who dare to denounce such facts is ridiculous.

[Torah613]

Moshe - you did tell us yet: Who is the author of this article, and what kind of French newspaper was it printed in?

[As several have pointed out already - much of this article is nonsense].

And - to quote the Rebbe in a "slightly" related issue: ואם באמת האלט ער בא דער דרגא אודותה כותב - מפני מה אינו מקיים פס"ד הרמב"ם הל' דעות רפ"ו.

[mosheh5769]

Moshe - you did tell us yet: Who is the author of this article, and what kind of French newspaper was it printed in?
******ian Bouchet is the author, and he works for "La Resistance"

Please tell me what is nonsens in the article?

[mosheh5769]

http://www.sefer-torah.com/blog/

[Torah613]

Is he Jewish? Frum? Is it a Jewish paper? A non-Jewish paper known to support EY generally? Or just another French anti-semite?

I think it is very important to know who the writer is and in what kind of publication they are writing.

[mosheh5769]

Is he Jewish? Frum? Is it a Jewish paper? A non-Jewish paper known to support EY generally?

I think it is very important to know who the writer is and in what kind of publication they are writing.
His father is not Jewish, his mother is. He is not frum. It's not a Jewish paper. Their articles on Israel are not always positives (and I must confess that I am not a fan of the articles he wrote, but some facts that he quote was confirmed to me as true by Israelis I spoke with this Shabbes). Here in Europe we do not follow so much news in the local media which, in general, are very anti-Semitic here. I quoted his article only because some points I have been confirmed to me. So, I wonder what is nonsens in it?

[Torah613]

So we have another article by a (probably) self hating Jew, written in a paper with a negative attitude to EY, and we are wasting space and time discussing it?

As the Satmar Rov used to say - when Arabs bash Zionists, they mean all Jews, not only the "medinah", and therefore they are against us also.

Meshulam did a decent job of pointing out much of the nonsense.

Writing about the growing old population as if that was a bad thing? Or does it perhaps reflect on the quality of the health care there?

That Jews rip off Jews. As he himself points out, that is not limited to EY (and happens among "unzere anti Zionist tzaddikim" also - all the time...). That is a result of the human nature known as greed...

That many are poor? If there is an anti-work ethic at play, you expect them to have money?

Etc. etc.

I am not in the mood to get into long political debates here - I am just a bit disturbed about the glee that greets an article printed in the generally anti-semetic French press... somehow I do not think that was my Rebbe's way... (and yes, I heard the Rebbe speak out against Zionism etc.).

[mosheh5769]

That the Jews are poor in Israel is not a sin, but that the state makes money and has had years and years of economic growth but does not help its people is shameful for a "Jewish State". To have an aging population is not a bad thing, but not dealing with it and sometimes treating them as ... is a bad thing. Cheating survivors of the Holocaust can happen anywhere but in Israel ...That was the point of the article. It is a state that has lost sight of its Jewish values while continuing to be called "Jewish State". If you want to be a Jewish state, you must realize that this necessarily implies certain responsibilities. Except if you're of the opinion that "Jew" is a decoration.

[Torah613]

Per capita it probably helps its people as much if not more than other countries.

But as someone pointed out already, this is a veiled appeal to a purer form of socialism - which will eventually doom its people to more misery.

[mosheh5769]

Per capita it probably helps its people as much if not more than other countries.

But as someone pointed out already, this is a veiled appeal to a purer form of socialism - which will eventually doom its people to more misery.
Me, socialist??? Just the word makes me vomit...The day I'll promote socialism has not happened yet. It's an appeal to an authentic attachment to Torah values in the Medinah. That's all. Anyway...

[mosheh5769]

Per capita it probably helps its people as much if not more than other countries.
Maybe, but they are not doing enough compared to the economic growth and potential of the Medinah, especially since it is a "Jewish" state.

[existwhere?]

So we have another article by a (probably) self hating Jew, written in a paper with a negative attitude to EY, and we are wasting space and time discussing it?

As the Satmar Rov used to say - when Arabs bash Zionists, they mean all Jews, not only the "medinah", and therefore they are against us also.

Meshulam did a decent job of pointing out much of the nonsense.

Writing about the growing old population as if that was a bad thing? Or does it perhaps reflect on the quality of the health care there?

That Jews rip off Jews. As he himself points out, that is not limited to EY (and happens among "unzere anti Zionist tzaddikim" also - all the time...). That is a result of the human nature known as greed...

That many are poor? If there is an anti-work ethic at play, you expect them to have money?

Etc. etc.

I am not in the mood to get into long political debates here - I am just a bit disturbed about the glee that greets an article printed in the generally anti-semetic French press... somehow I do not think that was my Rebbe's way... (and yes, I heard the Rebbe speak out against Zionism etc.).
Thank you, your posts are always interesting and well done.

[Torah613]

Your welcome, at least someone likes them.

[mosheh5769]

Your welcome, at least someone likes them.

I like them too. Without you, there is no open debates on this forum. Anyway, it doesn't mean we cannot have different POV as you told me one day. Anyway, Israel must improve in so many areas to truly be a State enjoyable for Jews.

[mosheh5769]

So, the conclusion of all this is that Israel is a country like any other "western" country (just to remeber you that we are in the period of Chanukah), so what happen there is quite normal.

[noahidelaws]

No--it's much worse there, because the wicked Jews there seek to contaminate the Jewish soul, while the goyim in exile only attack the body. Thus, we should be happy that we don't live under the rule of the wicked Jews in EY--see here (http://chabadlibrarybooks.com/pdfpager.aspx?req=15727&st=&pgnum=80&hilite=). Hashem yeracheim.

[mosheh5769]

Apparently Chabad doesn't care anymore...

[noahidelaws]

I never said that the Rebbeim said not to live there. At the same time, one shouldn't be under the illusion that everything there is peachy and idyllic.

Plenty of Lubavitchers care.

[mosheh5769]

I never said that the Rebbeim said not to live there.
Never said that too.

At the same time, one shouldn't be under the illusion that everything there is peachy and idyllic.
Some think that everything is going well there and those who dare to denounce the true situation are called "Neturei Karta" or "Satmar", as if the latter had a monopoly on opposing Zionism.

Plenty of Lubavitchers care.
What I read here makes me think that iit's not the case for Klal Chabad.

[noahidelaws]

What I read here makes me think that iit's not the case for Klal Chabad.
No, I think it has mainly infected "official Chabad", not rank-and-file Chassidim.

[mosheh5769]

No, I think it has mainly infected "official Chabad", not rank-and-file Chassidim.
Let's us hope so.