"We have a rebbe"?

[GreenEagle]

At a yud-alef nisan fabrengen, the rabbi said (approximately), "this day is a celebration of the fact that we have a Rebbe". What is the meaning of that considering the Rebbe is no longer alive?

[noahidelaws]

See here here, here, here and here.

[Lamp Lighter]

oy vey.

[GreenEagle]

Originally Posted by Lamp Lighter

oy vey.

Can you clarify? Are you referring to my question or to the response? And what is objectionable?

[Lamp Lighter]

I think you need to do the explaining.

What does the Rebbe not physically being here have to do with him being our Rebbe?

There are pleeeenty of discussions on this, and 4 links from a blog were provided.

In short, why do other Chassidic groups need to keep replacing their Rebbe with a new? Why is it that Chassidic groups have infighting on who should be Rebbe.

The Rebbe himself refused an entire year of pressure to become Rebbe.

Our Chassidus, our connection to Hashem is not dependent on a tzaddik in the flesh. It is dependent on the words that he says, the words recorded, and the teachings that are eternal, unlike flesh and blood.

[Torah613]

Originally Posted by Lamp Lighter

In short, why do other Chassidic groups need to keep replacing their Rebbe with a new? Why is it that Chassidic groups have infighting on who should be Rebbe.

Oh, please. Don't confuse a lechatchila with a bedieved (and worse). [And .. Chabad had the same...].

[Lamp Lighter]

Originally Posted by Torah613

Oh, please. Don't confuse a lechatchila with a bedieved (and worse). [And .. Chabad had the same...].

You said potato, I say tomato

[Torah613]

Oh, right. Got it.
I should have thought of that.

[Lamp Lighter]

Back to the matter at hand.

How can it be possible that we still have a Rebbe even though we cant physically see him. I phrased it that way as to not hurt any Lubavitchers feelings. Except one. There is always one.

[Torah613]

Hurt feelings? Chas ve'sholom.
But some will react - to "phrases" that (to them) make no sense (or are wrong). Some people just have that weakness, I guess.

[GreenEagle]

Well, I don't think I deserved a dismissive "oy vey" for asking a perfectly reasonable question.

The way of the world (both secular and Jewish) is to replace a leader who passes away... for example kings, presidents, business owners, rebbes (including Chabad 6 times!).

I would have liked the rabbi at the fabrengen to clarify this... unless he somehow assumed everyone there would understand automatically.

[Torah613]

Depends who the rest of the crowd was.

[Lamp Lighter]

Judaism doesnt believe in "replacement" only carrying the Torch. There was someone to carry the Torah in Chabad until the Rebbe and after his histalkus there was no one. Same goes for Breslov. 2 of the most successful dynasties who actually learn Chassidus.

Today in the rest of the Chassidish world, the sons are grooming themselves to become Rebbe before the histalkus!

They fight, physical bitter fights like Satmar and vizhinitz.

If something needs clarification you need to take initiative and call out the rabbi.

[MahTovChelkeinu]

I appreciate your giving Mr. Eagle some friendly advice, but the loshon harah about other chassidic groups is unneccesary and often incorrect. Please don't fall into the "we're better than them" game and focus on the question at hand.

[Torah613]

MTC - you are taking away all the fun from some... especially those that probably are lacking some history.

[chossidnistar]

these. "chassidic groups" are doing the right think, they need a Rebbe

[chossidnistar]

Originally Posted by GreenEagle

Well, I don't think I deserved a dismissive "oy vey" for asking a perfectly reasonable question.

The way of the world (both secular and Jewish) is to replace a leader who passes away... for example kings, presidents, business owners, rebbes (including Chabad 6 times!).

I would have liked the rabbi at the fabrengen to clarify this... unless he somehow assumed everyone there would understand automatically.

it's a good question with not 100% staright answers

[noahidelaws]

I think this post, the second one linked to above, will be most helpful to you. Please let me know what you think.

[Lamp Lighter]

Originally Posted by MahTovChelkeinu

I appreciate your giving Mr. Eagle some friendly advice, but the loshon harah about other chassidic groups is unneccesary and often incorrect. Please don't fall into the "we're better than them" game and focus on the question at hand.

Im glad you appreciate it. I also would appreciate some honesty too. Besides the fact that it isnt Lashon Horah I spent a great deal of time away from Lubavitch immersed in the chagas chassidic communities in monsey, ny and eretz yisroel. 2 things I learned were that Chassidim today are basically just like the litvish. Super frum and dont learn Chassidus. Sure they have vortlach here and there and everyone loves the kedushas levi and sfas emes but there is no serious learning of chassidus the way that Chabad and Breslov learn chassidus. Is that my opinion? No, its the words of a Satmar Chasid.

The satmar rebbe the Divrei Yoel himself admited that his derech is not the way of the Baal Shem tov and he doesnt think any other group is either.

Chagas chassidus is entirely dependent on their Rebbe and can not function at all without one.

Chabad can and that is how Chabad chassidim stayed chassidim in Russia without the FR or the Rebbe.

and "I think I am better than" attitude. Dont even get me started on Lubavitch today, and why I spent so many years away, ashamed, embarassed and people wearing kapotas and making a mockery of the Rebbe and Chabad Chassidus.

Thats for another thread though.

[chossidnistar]

Do you know how many Lubavitchers were at the Tzemach Tzekek's time?

[Lamp Lighter]

Originally Posted by chossidnistar

Do you know how many Lubavitchers were at the Tzemach Tzekek's time?

Do you? I find it hard to believe there was any census being taken. With that said, Lubavitch is, wasnt and never will be the largest chassidic group. You can speculate your own reasons why and why not.

Do you know how many Chassidic Rebbeim were Poskim in the time of the Tzemach Tezedek?

Isnt it the Tzemach Tzedek's leadership that brought back most of the chassidim of Strashelye?

What are we even talking about here?

Is the Rebbe our Rebbe anymore after Gimmel Tammuz is the question.

[chossidnistar]

Originally Posted by Lamp Lighter

Do you? I find it hard to believe there was any census being taken. With that said, Lubavitch is, wasnt and never will be the largest chassidic group. You can speculate your own reasons why and why not. .

are you a prophet?

Originally Posted by Lamp Lighter

What are we even talking about here?

Is the Rebbe our Rebbe anymore after Gimmel Tammuz is the question.

we are trying to answer a legitimate question
we have the Rebbe's sichos, maamarim,igros,instructions,peulos
we know that you can have an iskashrus through all these,
but is this something that is for everyone?
as you see that is a question that newcommers are asking
we are in a terrible matzav b/c we don't have the Rebbe physsically.(if you live in CH ,KC,or Tsfat,you can relate more to this)it's not the ideal situation!
we need the REBBEI
the question is very legitimate

[noahidelaws]

I see that the content in the links cited were not addressed at all by the questioner, which I find rather odd; as that may be, I await such comments. See also here.

[Lamp Lighter]

Originally Posted by chossidnistar

are you a prophet?


we are trying to answer a legitimate question
we have the Rebbe's sichos, maamarim,igros,instructions,peulos
we know that you can have an iskashrus through all these,
but is this something that is for everyone?
as you see that is a question that newcommers are asking
we are in a terrible matzav b/c we don't have the Rebbe physsically.(if you live in CH ,KC,or Tsfat,you can relate more to this)it's not the ideal situation!
we need the REBBEI
the question is very legitimate

Are you serious?

So the chassidim that were stuck in Russia and didnt know of the histalkus of the FR and never in their lifetime got to meet the Rebbe and see his face, they didnt have a Rebbe?

If your "having a Rebbe" is that limited then what was the point? What was the point of everything the Rebbe said to prepare us? Did he say you better find a new Rebbe?

When the Rebbe Rashab says that the purpose of the publishing of Tanya was so that people didnt have to travel to the Alter Rebbe and that when you learn Tanya you are having a conversation with the Alter Rebbe, what is the purpose?

To show you that Chabad chassidus is above the physical.

We arent discussing here if it hurts or not that we dont have a Rebbe in the physical. That we cant go to fahbrangens, and here new chassidus that could help us now. To have his blessings from his mouth to our ear. We arent talking about any of that.

We are asking a question. Do we have a Rebbe. The answer is YES or NO and if you say NO, that is fine, you arent a chasid of the Rebbe. That doesnt stop you from doing anything. If you answer YES then none of your logic for your stance will change NO so then what are we doing here?

Wasting time?

Since the Rebbe is our Rebbe we should be doing all that he asked of us during this time.

Gut Moed.

[chossidnistar]

If you think that the way that most of LUbs are conducting their lifes, is the way the Rebbe wants, there is nothing to talk about.
If you see the opposite, this would mean that for these ppl, is not working